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Nobody should die from going to a football game, but that's oldschool ultras gangs for you... Those guys have nothing better to do than organise and attend fights. Most, on the Balkans at least, are neonazis. Sometimes those fights end up badly when things get out of control. I have little sympathy if the one that got killed was part of those gangs. Ultras culture around here has NOTHING to do with the sport of football. Levski Sofia ultras are notorious for being involved with human trafficking and drug distribution, for example.

Well, the core of the ultras of many teams are criminals. And that's not only here, on the Balkans. It's all around Europe.

There will always be idiots whose only reason to "support" a club is to get into a fight with other fans.
 

SiamoNoi

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First reports are that some Greek killed that "poor" guy (it was in our news from a reporter currently in Greece). They arrested around 100 people and have their DNA so we should find out soon.
 

SiamoNoi

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Should be only about things like this:

364808159_195940110125157_4674347192722020505_n.jpg


Massive friendly game in a month for our young basketball club. Few years ago there was a friendly between futsal clubs.
Cancelled now cause of this. Fucking great.
 

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Well, the core of the ultras of many teams are criminals. And that's not only here, on the Balkans. It's all around Europe.

There will always be idiots whose only reason to "support" a club is to get into a fight with other fans.
Yeah, I'm not saying it's exclusive to the Balkans, but when you're a poor ass sob, it's way easier for actual gangs to recruit you for being a brainless brute and use you for their business. If we had proper education and working opportunities for young people it would be harder for them to be swayed into being criminals for a living.

The fraternity thing is another thing - those people lack a fatherly figure or siblings and they find that in the ultras group. And alongside this fraternity they get, as is the case around here, they also get an ideology. Neo nazi in the worst case and freak borderline nazi patriotism in the best.

Then the mafia, as criminals with political power, recruit those groups wholesale. It's the perfect marriage. Lost young people that are willing to do all kinds of shit for validation (and money) and a lot of shady shit to be done under the patronage of those powerful people. It's a vicious circle.
 

SiamoNoi

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There is no such a thing in Croatia. Ultras are just ultras (no one is guiding them). With all things that are coming with that kind of life. Nothing more.

Only (small) group that criminal (Zdravko Mamić) recruited with his money was quickly erased by real ultras and with his fall from untouchable to man on the run from the law.




This Dinamo-AEK thing is getting really ugly. Media there (and most of our media also with their google translate-copy-paste journalism) are writing so many nonsense (lies like that Croatians stabbed some children and other inocent people on the street etc) from the beginning and want to portrait AEK fans as an angels. Feeling is police is doing the similar and are hiding so many things cause no one is mentioning that 7 Croatians are stabbed and some multiple times (with their own knives apparently cause they attacked inocent people without knives). No one mentioning AEK fans that organized the whole "meeting" almost in a deal with their police is a feeling cause they knew our shitheads are coming and did nothing,there are somehow like 100 Croatians in jail and maybe only 10 people from Greece). All of that and some more + many remembering how they attacked Croatian fans with molotov and almost burned people alive...pure luck they didn't like it was a pure luck no one of 7 stabbed Croatian shitheads are also dead.


For sake of everyone involved I hope AEK fans will never show up in Zagreb cause it will be lot uglier that in Greece even without their knives.
 
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Aek fans organized the whole meeting? 🤣🤣🤣 I guess they also forced 100 Croats to travel to Athens without tickets when away fans weren't allowed and they also equipped them with all that stuff that were found in their possession

Screenshot_20230813-154949_Samsung Internet.jpg

Screenshot_20230813-154812_Samsung Internet.jpg


I get we all support a team and we want to believe the best for the club and its fans but there's a limit to that when reality shows differently.
 

brehme1989

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Wild rumours now suggesting that AEK fans did this to their own - some past beef between themselves- which would be beyond insane.

It feels like speculation now but with these things you can never know.

@Il Drago the scene was set up by both sets of fans. No escaping that reality. The people who participated knew what they signed up for. And for this, you can understand why society is rotten.
 

SiamoNoi

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No one forced them to travel and no one said that. But they didn't attacked (who attacked who between two groups is not even important here) some innocent people on the street in AEK colours near the stadium like media is writing. That guy who was killed was not some random AEK fan and Greek lawyer Alexis Kougias also said that he is not innocent either. It was organized fight between two groups (you can find about that days before on social media etc.,AEK fans even showing knifes inviting other side to come). No innocent people involved from BOTH sides. Why Croatians are filling the jail while almost no one from the other side is arrested? I get that they are trying to find out who killed that guy but it almost looks like they are at the same time protecting their own hooligans for some weird reasons. Who stabbed 7 from the other side? It's even better question why no one is writing about that like that part didn't even happened. And they are not writing cause whole propaganda is BBB attacked innocent AEK fans which is just not true at all. It was one of many organized ultras fights you can see all around the Europe on a weekly basis almost but with horrible ending.

Hope I was clearer this time.

Point is that there is strong propaganda about BBB who went to Greece just to randomly attack innocent AEK fans in their neighbourhood (again,why are they having knives if they are so innocent and who stabbed 7 from the other side?) and killed a guy (so far we don't know yet who killed him...just one guy from Croatia is suspect,one Albanian somehow and 3 people from Greece). And people here are not taking this lightly. Instead of doing everything to calm down situation and to speak about facts what actually happened,it looks like some people really want this to explode even further.
 
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SiamoNoi

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Wild rumours now suggesting that AEK fans did this to their own - some past beef between themselves- which would be beyond insane.

It feels like speculation now but with these things you can never know.
Well,this is really interesting. Cause before there was a news in the media about whole thing that BBB attacked innocent people,there was AEK fans on the internet with pictures about some guy they stabbed and laughing about that. After whole thing blow out and no one is mentioning that anymore. So who knows what actually happened. But that same lawyer I mentioned is saying that police have key moment on the camera and body of the killer but not face cause he was wearing a mask.
 
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IM21

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Why the fuck would you go to Athens, if you cant go to the game?... these morons went there to cause trouble. Fuck them all. Hope they all end up in prison.
 

varmin

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If we had proper education and working opportunities for young people it would be harder for them to be swayed into being criminals for a living.
For Bulgaria in particular I think the main reason is that the bad boys image which was imposed on the society in 90s. Those criminal guys with black glasses and suits were above the law, they had a lot of money, power and chicks, and later they turned to "respectable" business men. Many young people wanted (and still want) to be like them.
I recall when I was in the Naval Academy Varna, there was one guy in our group, who was dreaming after getting his diploma to go working on yachts where all big bosses, chicks, drugs and money are. He wasn't bad educated or poor in general, but for him and many others this is the cream of the cream - make some connections to get in the big biznis where one can have booze, money, girls and drugs as much as one likes.
I don't know how is the current generation, but based on the most recent example (disfiguared girl from Stara Zagora), I think that their priorities are the same more or less.
 

SiamoNoi

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Why the fuck would you go to Athens, if you cant go to the game?... these morons went there to cause trouble. Fuck them all. Hope they all end up in prison.
Cause that's what ultras usually do,it's not that big of a science. Sometimes 20 of them,sometimes 60,sometimes 150,sometimes 200. They are going everywhere. If you don't understand,you don't understand. Nothing more to say here really.

Better question is why they allowed them (they were stopped before few times on the borders,nothing unusual) to come cause police from both Croatia and Montenegro informed police in Greece that they are going. They got every possible information,about their cars,hotels etc. And they still did nothing. They did nothing on the border. They did nothing in the city. They even have their own videos of them from the streets going to AEK neughbourhood and still did nothing. Why? Almost like you can make some really interesting theories here...
 

brehme1989

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The police in Greece sucks and is very politically driven. They do what their ministry advises, not what their job description suggests.
It was for the benefit of the government to have a big fight here as they'd be able to reinforce their fucked up "no away fans" rules, which ironically has caused more fan trouble and violence than before, it's just that it's less likely to take place at stadiums.. or something else they wanted to do, such as monopolize the news with this rather than the poor reaction to the wildfires etc.

They couldn't have anticipated that this would also contain a lethal interaction. And that's why a lot of people blame them. They let the ultras "play" and now they shout that the game is bad. They know that the Athenian ultras scene has knives. Lots of them. UEFA also knows this.
 

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For Bulgaria in particular I think the main reason is that the bad boys image which was imposed on the society in 90s. Those criminal guys with black glasses and suits were above the law, they had a lot of money, power and chicks, and later they turned to "respectable" business men. Many young people wanted (and still want) to be like them.
I recall when I was in the Naval Academy Varna, there was one guy in our group, who was dreaming after getting his diploma to go working on yachts where all big bosses, chicks, drugs and money are. He wasn't bad educated or poor in general, but for him and many others this is the cream of the cream - make some connections to get in the big biznis where one can have booze, money, girls and drugs as much as one likes.
I don't know how is the current generation, but based on the most recent example (disfiguared girl from Stara Zagora), I think that their priorities are the same more or less.
Nothing has changed, sadly. Those guys are just in their 30s now and they have kids of their own. We're fucked as a society for generations to come.
 

brehme1989

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Cool beans. Hyped, thank VAR...
 

IM21

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nice goal by En Nesyri in uefa super cup
 
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