Edson Arantes do Nascimento

[Kato]

*cough* this is not a maradona VS pele thread.. & umm look up 2 posts & it says that would be ur last post in here

maybe u should take the hint & create a virtual fight thread..

 

[Cro Nerazzurro]

one question, why didnt pele come to europe?

scared...he wouldnt be greatest if he came to play in best leagues in europe

 

[Frisko]

He answered that question martin... he wasn't a mercenary and he stayed in Brazil, playing in the place he loved.

You win a WC when you're 17, then another when you're 29, then we'll talk

 

[Sisenando]

He answered that question martin... he wasn't a mercenary and he stayed in Brazil, playing in the place he loved.

If only the Brazilians nowadays followed in his footsteps. Players like Robinho and Ronaldo bring shame to the term 'loyalty', which Pele preserved. It pains me to say that money controls the game so much now. However, Pele is the epitome of a great loyal footballer. He was an example of a glorious player at the time where football was played because of passion and love. And in my opinion, Pele is synonymous with football because of that.

 

[Cro Nerazzurro]

pele didnt won the WC alone, no one can do it so that means nothing...

we are talking about his own abilitys, they wore great , but not the greatest...

not even close

 

[catanha]

Pele and loyalty? HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHHHHHHAAHAHHAAHAHAHHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA


Pele: "This Brasilian team is a joke, the Brasilian team of my generation would walk all over this team"

Real loyal, huh?

 

[Frisko]

pele didnt won the WC alone, no one can do it so that means nothing...

we are talking about his own abilitys, they wore great , but not the greatest...

not even close

Maradona didn't win shit on his own either...

 

[Handoyo]

If crictisizing a team, albeit in a wrong maner, is being disloyal, then I have to strongly disagree with you. It just means that Pele was furious and wants the best out of the National Team. For example, if Beppe Bergomi say that the Inter of 00/01 is a joke and his Inter of 88/89 would have walked all over them, does this mean that Il Zio is being disloyal? Absolutely definitely not!

I'm not really sure but I think Pele spent the whole of his club career in Santos, bar his MLS days. That alone is enough to tell me that he's loyal.


Handyo

 

[Frisko]

If crictisizing a team, albeit in a wrong maner, is being disloyal, then I have to strongly disagree with you. It just means that Pele was furious and wants the best out of the National Team. For example, if Beppe Bergomi say that the Inter of 00/01 is a joke and his Inter of 88/89 would have walked all over them, does this mean that Il Zio is being disloyal? Absolutely definitely not!

I'm not really sure but I think Pele spent the whole of his club career in Santos, bar his MLS days. That alone is enough to tell me that he's loyal.


Handyo

A M E N

 

[catanha]

If crictisizing a team, albeit in a wrong maner, is being disloyal, then I have to strongly disagree with you. It just means that Pele was furious and wants the best out of the National Team. For example, if Beppe Bergomi say that the Inter of 00/01 is a joke and his Inter of 88/89 would have walked all over them, does this mean that Il Zio is being disloyal? Absolutely definitely not!

I'm not really sure but I think Pele spent the whole of his club career in Santos, bar his MLS days. That alone is enough to tell me that he's loyal.


Handyo

But you see, Bergomi never said that about Inter. Baresi has never said that about Milan. Maradona has never said that about Argentina, infact he praised the team for its EFFORT in the World Cup, whereas Pele criticised the NT even though they won the World Cup.

Can someone remind me once again which Brasilian players it was who bagged out Pele? Was Ronaldo one?

 

[Handoyo]

If crictisizing a team, albeit in a wrong maner, is being disloyal, then I have to strongly disagree with you. It just means that Pele was furious and wants the best out of the National Team. For example, if Beppe Bergomi say that the Inter of 00/01 is a joke and his Inter of 88/89 would have walked all over them, does this mean that Il Zio is being disloyal? Absolutely definitely not!

I'm not really sure but I think Pele spent the whole of his club career in Santos, bar his MLS days. That alone is enough to tell me that he's loyal.


Handyo

But you see, Bergomi never said that about Inter. Baresi has never said that about Milan. Maradona has never said that about Argentina, infact he praised the team for its EFFORT in the World Cup, whereas Pele criticised the NT even though they won the World Cup.

Can someone remind me once again which Brasilian players it was who bagged out Pele? Was Ronaldo one?

In a hypothetical world, if Bergomi did say that, would you consider him a disloyal person? How a person reacts to a poor effort doesn't justify his loyalty, but perhaps his personality. Maybe Pele is a crybaby, but to accuse him of being disloyal after making a bad remark about his national team...I just don't see how can you link the 2 together.

By the way, just curious, was your nickname dedicated to a certain Brazilian who once played for Celta Vigo and made quite an impact in a season? (I believe it was 00/01 where he scored 15+ goals, can't really remember)


Handyo

 

[Cro Nerazzurro]

diego is god! pele is kid for him

 

[Kato]

:fero: cant u just make an I :heart: diego thread or something.. this is a PELE thread ffs


lets start usin this thread for the things Frisko intended.. so for anybody who wants them.. a few clips

http://s49.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=2ENMQRFRBSBZD0WHNXNBP7ADDP

http://s49.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=3H2IZ8729EEJT3AVRAH5QBH6RB

http://s49.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=2GGY0G21D5VQ63DTBEBZKZVLFK

http://s49.yousendit.com/d.aspx?id=1WSIXW28UB2XW159MQJ2DH06XI

ok, the first is a clip for the 1970 WC, its a quick time movie though

the second is an mpg of a goal of his against Romania (with commentary, Frisko)

3rd is a bicycle kick, Pele style

4th, another Pele bicycle kick

sorry I don't have much info, the sites I got these from weren't english

 

[Frisko]

:heart: Katie you're the best!

 

[Adriano@10]

i couldent say it any better frisko

 

[Hammoudi]

I missed on all the fun on this topic! To be honest, all the soccer fans that I run into don't have a Pele vs. Maradona debate, because it's settled, Pele is the better one.

I have not seen Pele play, but caught Maradona in his last good days. He was amazing, I still remember a Napoli-Milan game (can't remember when, but late 80's.) It was like a title decider, and Maradona carried his team, but they lost to the great Milan side. I really respected him after that after seeing how he single-handedly almost beat Milan.

I also saw his WC90 and WC94 performances, and they were not great. I saw clips of 86, and he was amazing.

Pele in the other hand was different. He won a WC at 17, and please don't say he had help. Maradona had help in all the world-cups, but he couldn't do better. Pele was scoring incredible goals, and was rising to the occassion.

As for him not going to Europe, you have to remember it was the 60's, it wasn't like now when moving was easier. Pele was loyal to Brazil, and wanted to enterain his true fans. He only moved to NY cosmos later in his last days to promote soccer in North America.

Pele is a great soccer ambassdor, but I can't say the same about Maradona. He took drugs, and he fathered illegitimate kids while married and the poor kid had to take a DNA test to prove Maradona is his father.

When you talk about the greatest player ever, you have to take character into considration. In terms of playing, Pele was slightly better than Maradona, but in terms of character, it's not even close.

Cro, you are the first person on earth to utter the words "Pele Sucks"!

Catanha, I understand your points, but you are subjective in this argument I think. You are Argentinian, and if I was so, I'd probably claim that Maradona is better.

P.S: Maybe the poor england player didn't respond to Maradona because he didn't understand what he said But don't worry, I consider that a positive of Maradona, I didn't like the English NT

 

[Cro Nerazzurro]

IAM NOT FIRST, my best friend thinks that too...

 

[catanha]

Handoyo, you can't possibly say that, because Bergomi hasn't said it. If he did, you'd see Interisti calling him disloyal....how could such a great of a country, before such a big tournament come out and say that? The Brasilian players cracked it @ him, even Brasilians themselves weren't happy with his comments and his views on the NT, and not just because of that comment...but for years.
And you're right about my nickname, its is that celta player.

Hamed, who settled it? FIFA? I thought they decided both were as good as each other, hmm I must've missed it, because I never knew it was settled that Pele was the better one.
Maradona won a WC @ 17, good on him, but he did have help...that really doesn't take anything away from him but Maradona pretty much lead the Argentinean team into glory by himself, he was continually harassed beat them off....his impact on Argentina's WC was more than any other players for their respective countries, more than Kempes in 78, more than Zoff in 82 and more than Pele.

 

[Handoyo]

Handoyo, you can't possibly say that, because Bergomi hasn't said it. If he did, you'd see Interisti calling him disloyal....how could such a great of a country, before such a big tournament come out and say that? The Brasilian players cracked it @ him, even Brasilians themselves weren't happy with his comments and his views on the NT, and not just because of that comment...but for years.

Let me make another analogy then. Massimo Moratti, as you have said yourself, has made a lot of catastrophic decisions for Inter during his decade old reign as an Inter owner. The fans aren't happy at him and even call for his resignation. But does this mean that Moratti is disloyal to Inter? I just think that the attitude or behaviour of a player towards a club or a National Team sometimes doesn't have to do with his loyalty. I admit that it was wrong for Pele to whine at the Brazillian NT like that prior to the WC and the fans & players have every right to berate him for it. But for disloyalty? :wth:

And you're right about my nickname, its is that celta player.

Isn't he Brazillian? Any reasons why?


Handyo

 

[Kato]

:frustrat: :fero: Hey, I might aswell post those clips in the freakin Maradona thread, might actually be noticed, instead of all these fights over who was the best..