Roma - Inter (20 Jan 13)

[Mnassar]

We need a coach. Badly.

Who's Ninuk and Neon Blade? Are they Milan fans just postin shit here? Or are they little glory hunters who'll be cheering for Strama when we finish 3rd end of season?

 

[Shaun]

Who's Ninuk and Neon Blade? Are they Milan fans just postin shit here? Or are they little glory hunters who'll be cheering for Strama when we finish 3rd end of season?

Those two might be a little too negative when it comes to our team, but it's really hard to see the upside of this team right now. We play badly, we ignore youth, and we're just getting older and more predictable.

 

[Ed.]

I dont actually get about our team gets older shit just bcs rocchi played. We played with 3 over 30s in the beginning. Our average age at the kick off was 27. We ended the game with average of 28. Overall average was 27 too including all subs. This is definitely a younger team than last season when we had chivu-samuel-lucio-maicon as our back 4. We dont have many u25.. but our team average age is quite reasonable tbh.

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I dont actually get about our team gets older shit just bcs rocchi played. We played with 3 over 30s in the beginning. Our average age at the kick off was 27. We ended the game with average of 28. Overall average was 27 too including all subs. This is definitely a younger team than last season when we had chivu-samuel-lucio-maicon as our back 4. We dont have many u25.. but our team average age is quite reasonable tbh.

 

[francesco]

I dont actually get about our team gets older shit just bcs rocchi played. We played with 3 over 30s in the beginning. Our average age at the kick off was 27. We ended the game with average of 28. Overall average was 27 too including all subs. This is definitely a younger team than last season when we had chivu-samuel-lucio-maicon as our back 4. We dont have many u25.. but our team average age is quite reasonable tbh.

- - - Updated - - -

I dont actually get about our team gets older shit just bcs rocchi played. We played with 3 over 30s in the beginning. Our average age at the kick off was 27. We ended the game with average of 28. Overall average was 27 too including all subs. This is definitely a younger team than last season when we had chivu-samuel-lucio-maicon as our back 4. We dont have many u25.. but our team average age is quite reasonable tbh.

the known problem with average is the outliers
If you have extreme scores (outlier) it will distort the average number

let's see our player
livaja 19
juan 21
obi 21
frog 24
nagatomo 26
guarin 26
pereira 27
gargano 28
handanovic 28
palacio 30
mundigayi 31
chivu 32
rochi 35
zanetti 39

so for starter
19 21 24 26 26 27 28 28 30 32 39
N =11
mean : 27
list of deviaton -8 -6 -2 -1 -1 +1 +1 +3 +5 +12
square of deviation 64, 36, 4 ,1 ,1 ,1 ,1 , 9, 25, 144
sum of squared deviation : 286
divided by N-1 = 28.6
square root of 28.6 = 5.34

let's see whether JZ is outlier or not
G = (39-27) / 5.34 = 2.24
people usually assumes that "normal" data will all fall within around 2 standard deviations of the mean or referred as the 95% confidence interval
so 39 is has less than a 5% chance of being a true data point or more than 95% chance of being outliers

after subs come in
21 21 24 26 27 28 30 31 32 35 39
N=11
mean : 28
list of deviaton -7 -7 -4 -2 -1 +2 +3 +4 +7 +11
square of deviation 49, 49, 16 ,4 ,1 ,4 ,9 , 16, 49, 121
sum of squared deviation : 318
divided by N-1 = 31.8
square root of 31.8 = 5.63

let's see JZ
G = (39-28) / 5.63 = 1.95

this one seems better because jz is not an outlier
but as you can see it's because we put more older player

I don't think using average will be a good idea for this case as for starting line up we have outliers and for the after subs we have more older players

feel free to correct me if above calculation is wrong

 

[Wallace]

the known problem with average is the outliers
If you have extreme scores (outlier) it will distort the average number

Very insightful post, average is always misleading regardless of mean, median, and mode.

 

[Mnassar]

Those two might be a little too negative when it comes to our team, but it's really hard to see the upside of this team right now. We play badly, we ignore youth, and we're just getting older and more predictable.

Dude, the number of boo boys on this forum is far too high. Especially Strama haters; when we had the 7 game streak earlier in the season it was all Stramala and Stramalove (except Browha) and now it's fuck this and fuck that. We have a shitty squad, get over it... a great young manager who's learning as he goes along and finally what looks like some interesting youngsters and younger players on which to develop the team; JJ, Rano, Yuto, Benassi?, Cou, Guarin... I think Strama had a great game here... sure we were pinned back by Roma in the first half but we reacted well, closed them down and were unlucky not to take the lead. The fact that our star performers were totally spent by the 75th minute is why i guess he closed down instead of pushing for the win. Anyway, it's really not too bleak from where I'm sitting.

 

[spork]

the known problem with average is the outliers
If you have extreme scores (outlier) it will distort the average number

:fffuuu: You just had to bring basic statistical methods into this after I had almost forgotten everything I learned last fall.
Anyways, here's another way to find outliers since you guys keep talking about average ages of the team...

Hypothetical starting XI:
19 21 24 26 26 27 28 28 30 32 39

n=11
mean = 27.272727...

Quartile 1 (Q1) = 24
Quartile 2 (Q2) = 27
Quartile 3 (Q3) = 30

Interquartile Range is:
Q3 - Q1 = 30 - 24 = 6

1.5 X IQR = 9
Q1 - 1.5*IQR = 24 - 9 = 15 edobear:
Q3 + 1.5*IQR = 30 + 9 = 39

Any values below 15 or above 39 (years of age) indicate a suspected outlier. Since JZ falls right at 39, he is certainly not one.


When subs come into the game:
21 21 24 26 27 28 30 31 32 35 39
n=11
mean = 28.54545454...


Quartile 1 (Q1) = 24
Quartile 2 (Q2) = 28
Quartile 3 (Q3) = 32


Interquartile Range is:
Q3 - Q1 = 32 - 24 = 8

1.5 X IQR = 12
Q1 - 1.5*IQR = 24 - 12 = 12 edobear:
Q3 + 1.5*IQR = 32 + 12 = 44

Again, any values below 12 or above 44 (years of age) indicate a suspected outlier. Again, JZ is not an outlier.

With that being said, not one single player in either of the two situations are considered to be outliers, even though there is a right sided skew when you distribute these ages in a Standard Normal curve.

(Feel free to correct me if I have made any mistakes.)

 

[Fitzy]

I've never taken a statistics class, and now I know why...

 

[Ed.]

:fffuuu: You just had to bring basic statistical methods into this after I had almost forgotten everything I learned last fall.
Anyways, here's another way to find outliers since you guys keep talking about average ages of the team...

Hypothetical starting XI:
19 21 24 26 26 27 28 28 30 32 39

n=11
mean = 27.272727...

Quartile 1 (Q1) = 24
Quartile 2 (Q2) = 27
Quartile 3 (Q3) = 30

Interquartile Range is:
Q3 - Q1 = 30 - 24 = 6

1.5 X IQR = 9
Q1 - 1.5*IQR = 24 - 9 = 15 edobear:
Q3 + 1.5*IQR = 30 + 9 = 39

Any values below 15 or above 39 (years of age) indicate a suspected outlier. Since JZ falls right at 39, he is certainly not one.


When subs come into the game:
21 21 24 26 27 28 30 31 32 35 39
n=11
mean = 28.54545454...


Quartile 1 (Q1) = 24
Quartile 2 (Q2) = 28
Quartile 3 (Q3) = 32


Interquartile Range is:
Q3 - Q1 = 32 - 24 = 8

1.5 X IQR = 12
Q1 - 1.5*IQR = 24 - 12 = 12 edobear:
Q3 + 1.5*IQR = 32 + 12 = 44

Again, any values below 12 or above 44 (years of age) indicate a suspected outlier. Again, JZ is not an outlier.

With that being said, not one single player in either of the two situations are considered to be outliers, even though there is a right sided skew when you distribute these ages in a Standard Normal curve.

(Feel free to correct me if I have made any mistakes.)

the known problem with average is the outliers
If you have extreme scores (outlier) it will distort the average number

let's see our player
livaja 19
juan 21
obi 21
frog 24
nagatomo 26
guarin 26
pereira 27
gargano 28
handanovic 28
palacio 30
mundigayi 31
chivu 32
rochi 35
zanetti 39

so for starter
19 21 24 26 26 27 28 28 30 32 39
N =11
mean : 27
list of deviaton -8 -6 -2 -1 -1 +1 +1 +3 +5 +12
square of deviation 64, 36, 4 ,1 ,1 ,1 ,1 , 9, 25, 144
sum of squared deviation : 286
divided by N-1 = 28.6
square root of 28.6 = 5.34

let's see whether JZ is outlier or not
G = (39-27) / 5.34 = 2.24
people usually assumes that "normal" data will all fall within around 2 standard deviations of the mean or referred as the 95% confidence interval
so 39 is has less than a 5% chance of being a true data point or more than 95% chance of being outliers

after subs come in
21 21 24 26 27 28 30 31 32 35 39
N=11
mean : 28
list of deviaton -7 -7 -4 -2 -1 +2 +3 +4 +7 +11
square of deviation 49, 49, 16 ,4 ,1 ,4 ,9 , 16, 49, 121
sum of squared deviation : 318
divided by N-1 = 31.8
square root of 31.8 = 5.63

let's see JZ
G = (39-28) / 5.63 = 1.95

this one seems better because jz is not an outlier
but as you can see it's because we put more older player

I don't think using average will be a good idea for this case as for starting line up we have outliers and for the after subs we have more older players

feel free to correct me if above calculation is wrong

:trollol: :chan:

So wuts d problem if jz is an outlider? Jz plays like a 28 years old.

 

[Devious]

Using the laws of nature trying to explain a supernatural phenomenon is a fallacy.

 

[francesco]

:fffuuu: You just had to bring basic statistical methods into this after I had almost forgotten everything I learned last fall.
Anyways, here's another way to find outliers since you guys keep talking about average ages of the team...

Hypothetical starting XI:
19 21 24 26 26 27 28 28 30 32 39

n=11
mean = 27.272727...

Quartile 1 (Q1) = 24
Quartile 2 (Q2) = 27
Quartile 3 (Q3) = 30

Interquartile Range is:
Q3 - Q1 = 30 - 24 = 6

1.5 X IQR = 9
Q1 - 1.5*IQR = 24 - 9 = 15 edobear:
Q3 + 1.5*IQR = 30 + 9 = 39

Any values below 15 or above 39 (years of age) indicate a suspected outlier. Since JZ falls right at 39, he is certainly not one.


When subs come into the game:
21 21 24 26 27 28 30 31 32 35 39
n=11
mean = 28.54545454...


Quartile 1 (Q1) = 24
Quartile 2 (Q2) = 28
Quartile 3 (Q3) = 32


Interquartile Range is:
Q3 - Q1 = 32 - 24 = 8

1.5 X IQR = 12
Q1 - 1.5*IQR = 24 - 12 = 12 edobear:
Q3 + 1.5*IQR = 32 + 12 = 44

Again, any values below 12 or above 44 (years of age) indicate a suspected outlier. Again, JZ is not an outlier.

With that being said, not one single player in either of the two situations are considered to be outliers, even though there is a right sided skew when you distribute these ages in a Standard Normal curve.

(Feel free to correct me if I have made any mistakes.)

ah inter quartile range (iqr)
interestingly I was going to use it yesterday until I realized the statistical problem with iqr: it only measured the range from the 25th to the 75th percentile of a variable.

one advantage of the interquartile range is that it indicates the concentration for the middle one-half of the distribution, and ignoring the extremes of the distribution. So we use IQR for statistical analysis when the extremes are of less interest or we need more consideration of the middle part of the distribution. well, what do you expect? we are eliminating the lower one-quarter and the upper one-quarter where the outliers might happens

so yes, iqr is only useful to measure of variation in that it describes the extent of variation over the middle part of a distribution, the age of 24 to 30, which in this case, of course, we have 6 or 7 of them in our team.

The disadvantage of the interquartile range is that it is a positional measure, in our case IQR provides a good summary of how varied the more typical age are. It doesn't show how varied our squad's age are
the standard deviation and variance,on the other hand, are the remedy of this disdavantages
This is the reason why I chose standard deviation and not IQR

you cannot use statistical analysis without consideration
if you did that you only use it to show what you want to see instead of what really happen
Statistics help you understand and see trends in data
you can use any method you want, but once you missused it, you get a meaningless result
by using IQR, as you proofed already, it gives a fake comforts that our squad is okay, just as the fake comfort given from the average age of 27 to 28 years old
in fact, it is worrying if one of most our reliable players is 39