Inter's Financial Situation

[matt86hk]

i really have a smell of Parmalat on the deal

 

[Lyran]

Parmalat ???

Halp, please?

 

[Bluenine]

Anyone got any details on the financials of this takeover?

All the press reports that I am reading say that Suning bought a 68.5% stake at Inter for €270m. That is a valuation of €394m. Whatever happened to the 700m valuation that everyone was talking about?

 

[.h.]

it'll be how debt was handled. Debt is probably passing to Suning, which means Thohir's returns are diminished. The 700m valuation is probably still about par

 

[zhfzanetti]

Rumors from some Chinese social media sources said JZ will be the chairman running the business after ET been kicked out in couple of months, not so likely but now he is enjoying his talking with Alex Teixeira.

MM: Love is let go

 

[enjoy]

^ This is not Alex Teixeira!


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[Bluenine]

it'll be how debt was handled. Debt is probably passing to Suning, which means Thohir's returns are diminished. The 700m valuation is probably still about par

How is the debt passing to Suning if they have invested only €270m?

 

[.h.]

Because the debt sits with the club

They could buy the club for (say) 600m + no debt = Thohir takes 300m of debt as personal guarantees.

Or pay 300m for the club, with the 300m of debt residing with the club, and their remaining liability


this ties in roughly with the reports i've seen people cite, in that there is about 400m euros of debt at Inter all told. Including the Goldman debt for example


its the exact same as when Bates bought Chelsea for £1.

 

[zhfzanetti]

^ This is not Alex Teixeira!

You are right, this is Sammir, my bad

 

[didi]

This reminds me of Man City which was acquired first by Thai businessman poltician then sold to middle east buisnes men

 

[Bluenine]

Because the debt sits with the club

They could buy the club for (say) 600m + no debt = Thohir takes 300m of debt as personal guarantees.

Or pay 300m for the club, with the 300m of debt residing with the club, and their remaining liability


this ties in roughly with the reports i've seen people cite, in that there is about 400m euros of debt at Inter all told. Including the Goldman debt for example


its the exact same as when Bates bought Chelsea for £1.

True, but that would still make Inter's valuation €394m, not 700m. Debt does not add to the valuation. Just like when Bates bought Chelsea for £1, that made their valuation £1 at that time.

 

[.h.]

Yes but the point is if they had not bought the debt, we would have been valued 400m higher. It is a zero sum game as they will most likely buy out all the debt anyway which is the capital increase people are talking about, boosting our value by 400m.

 

[Bluenine]

Yes but the point is if they had not bought the debt, we would have been valued 400m higher. It is a zero sum game as they will most likely buy out all the debt anyway which is the capital increase people are talking about, boosting our value by 400m.

It doesn't work that way, bro. If Suning paid just €270m for 68.5% of Inter as the media reports claim, then our valuation is €394m. If they "buy" the debt (from that I assume you mean they will pay Goldmen Sachs and Inter will owe Suning instead), it does not impact our valuation at all.

I guess media is missing some part of the story, because it does not add up. Maybe Suning paid Moratti separately for his shares at a valuation of €700m, then everything would make sense.

Keep an eye out for details of this transaction, it would be interesting to know how it was structured.

 

[Armes]

^ Actually Moratti sold his shares to Thohir, confirmed it himself, then Thohir sold 70% to Suning.

 

[.h.]

It doesn't work that way, bro. If Suning paid just €270m for 68.5% of Inter as the media reports claim, then our valuation is €394m. If they "buy" the debt (from that I assume you mean they will pay Goldmen Sachs and Inter will owe Suning instead), it does not impact our valuation at all.

I guess media is missing some part of the story, because it does not add up. Maybe Suning paid Moratti separately for his shares at a valuation of €700m, then everything would make sense.

Keep an eye out for details of this transaction, it would be interesting to know how it was structured.

No - what I'm saying is they will recapitalisation and pay off the debt. I think the debt is at a holding company level and not inter itself, so it doesn't impact ffp

 

[matt86hk]

media is shit. They even confuse Suning Commerce Group with Suning Holdings Group and Suning Appliance Group.

Suning Commerce Group is a listed company, there was some regulation even lawless in China, they can't announce nothing for a 270M Euro deal. The true purchaser was Suning Sports (苏宁体育/蘇寧體育), a company owned by the shareholder of Suning Commerce, which they can hide the financial information (no one file real information for a private company in China).

The deals just shifted the financial information of upper stream holding company from Hong Kong which already a tax heaven, to China which nothing is disclosed , even listed company had two separate balance sheet for the public and for the board of directors.

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for the debt, as i know Inter borrowed 230M from Golden, while the holding company ISC borrowed 170M from Canada Pension Plan Investment Board.

all we need to hope was Suning Holdings was bought Inter Milan's share from International Sports Capital S.p.A., the direct holding company of Inter, NOT buying the share of upper stream shell company International Sports Capital S.p.A., International Sports Capital HK nor Asian Sports Ventures, which much harder to trace the purchase price, but only the change in share capital and shareholder.

 

[thatdude]

I just want to say that I love the intellectual financial discussion that takes place on this forum.

We have a legitimately smart forum.

 

[dedalus77]

all we need to hope was Suning Holdings was bought Inter Milan's share from International Sports Capital S.p.A., the direct holding company of Inter, NOT buying the share of upper stream shell company International Sports Capital S.p.A., International Sports Capital HK nor Asian Sports Ventures, which much harder to trace the purchase price, but only the change in share capital and shareholder.

Could you elaborate more on this part? Are you saying it's not certain at this point whether the "shares" purchased by Suning come from Inter's holding company or its "upper stream shell company"? Does this mean, on paper, Thohir sold his shares to one of those companies first, and then they sold them to Suning? Sorry, I am usually clueless about these business transaction details. I'd appreciate it if you could enlighten me.

p.s. What is "upper stream shell company" exactly? I mean I can guess what it means from what I know about shell company, but I've never heard of that term.

 

[Nyall]

I just want to say that I love the intellectual financial discussion that takes place on this forum.

We have a legitimately smart forum.

wait until we get a JJM original.

 

[matt86hk]

not sure change in ownership was filed immediately or not, but for Italian company please look at

http://www.registroimprese.it

for HK company

https://www.icris.cr.gov.hk

for China, nothing you can see.

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all we just knew on paper was Canada Pension Plan Investment Board accept the pledge of 70% Inter share for 170M Euro, which Eric just bought the rights to subscribe capital increase or old share for some price plus 75 million Euro new share.


Based on the news which quoting official announcement of Suning Sports, the price for about 70% was old shares plus capital increase, so it need original filing on increase in share capital to see how many new share was issued.

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if you know Mandarin, you could listen to the media conference. PPTV is a subsidiary of Suning Commerce , but i'm still finding which video is real

http://www.pptv.com/

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http://csl.pptv.com/suning/guomi/pc/index.html

may be this one