CL coefficients and why Serie A clubs struggle in Europa League

[Coasterfreek]

Well deserved!

+1. This is gonna look like a long time of suffering with this. It's embarrassing, but deserved as of right now.

 

[vitomins]

I don't understand why it is embarrassing? All countries have been through this period before. In the late 80's and 90's when Italy was dominating Europe, England was absolutely dreadful...they even fell all the way to 25th in the coefficient ranking! Spain also fell out of the top 4 in the 90's.

Italy dominated for so long, it is only natural that it has a bad spell.

 

[rockball]

Yea, but it's the first time since the game has gone so global and in the era of internet. Also with the kind of money others have now, the recovery is going to be difficult.

 

[Pharaoh]

Yeah does anybody know what exactly needs to happen hypothetically for Italy to get the 4th CL spot back?

 

[monster09]

Yeah does anybody know what exactly needs to happen hypothetically for Italy to get the 4th CL spot back?

Perform well for 5 years, well means better than German clubs.

From Wiki

This coefficient is determined by the results of the clubs of the leagues in UEFA Champions League and UEFA Europa League games over the past five seasons. Two points are awarded for each win by a club, and one for a draw (points are halved in the qualifying and playoff rounds). Goals scored in extra time do count in determining the outcome of a game, but any Penalty shootout result does not affect the allocation of points other than the bonus points. The number of points awarded each season is divided by the number of teams that participated for that nation in that season. This number is then rounded to three decimal places (e.g. 2⅔ would be rounded to 2.667).

For the league coefficient the season's league coefficients for the last five seasons must be added up. In the preliminary rounds of both the Champions League and Europa League, the awarded points are halved. Bonus points are allocated for:

Qualifying for the Champions League group phase (4 bonus points).
Reaching the second round of the Champions League (5 bonus points).
Reaching the quarter, semi and final of either the Champions League or the Europa League (1 bonus point).

The bonus points are added to the number of points scored in a season.

 

[rockball]

It depends on how teams like Roma, Udinese, Napoli do in EL next season onwards. In CL, Italy is still far ahead of German teams.

 

[Black&Blue]

I think that Bundesliga will surpass La Liga in a couple of years too (although Barca and RM)

 

[Mad Biscione]

Serie A will not get that 4thspot back anytime soon, its more likely to Bundesliga take over La Liga, year after year we are performing worse than german teams, what worse in the last two years Portugal and France has been better or on par with Serie A.
It's just better to get used to having three teams in UCL.
Obviously its all beacuse of poor results in Europa League

 

[Pharaoh]

Yeah I really hate how UCL spots are dependent on how EL teams do......thats just stupid it should solely depend on how well you do in UCL for UCL spots and how teams perform in EL for EL spots =/

 

[vitomins]

Ya, it will be at least another 5 years before we get that spot back...

 

[Mad Biscione]

Yeah I really hate how UCL spots are dependent on how EL teams do......thats just stupid it should solely depend on how well you do in UCL for UCL spots and how teams perform in EL for EL spots =/

Though it sucks for Italian mentality I 100% agree with the rules, I think it's good the ranking is one for CL and EL

 

[vasilios]

The current rules are fucking retarded. Including EL performance is one thing, but making it count as much as it does is ridiculous.

All you have to do is look at last year.

Portugal 'earned' the highest coefficient rating despite not having ONE team qualify from the CL group stages. Braga/Benfica fail to qualify in their CL groups and go on to earn more points for their country than nearly all the teams that did qualify from their groups. It's nonsense.

 

[Pharaoh]

Though it sucks for Italian mentality I 100% agree with the rules, I think it's good the ranking is one for CL and EL

You gotta explain your logic on this one cuz I can't disagree more!

 

[Mad Biscione]

First of all if CL had its own ranking it would be the same team playing for the next 50 years, you can say without a doubt that we have seen more NEW teams entering group stage in the last 4 years that in the previous 10 when its been all the same. And its a good thing.

How are champion teams from lower level leagues ever supposed to enter CL group stage otherwise if they are exluded from the "elite-only" CL ranking? Or maybe its locked for certain group of teams from privileged leagues? Uefa says: treat EL seriously, give your best in that competition, your league will go up in the ranking and as a result champion team from your country will skip some qualification stages in CL and thus will have greater chance of entering CL group stage.

Lower level league teams need work hard in EL to get their pay off in CL in the future, and thats good, treating CL and EL as a whole is right, its not about 2-3 top teams from each country against each other, it's the entire leagues competing. German teams worked hard in EL and they got their payoff, one more team in CL.

The rules are fair and nobody's complaining but Italy, Italian teams dont give a shit about EL and it's their problem. Trust me everyone happy with these rules but ever-complaining Italians.

 

[Pharaoh]

First of all if CL had its own ranking it would be the same team playing for the next 50 years, you can say without a doubt that we have seen more NEW teams entering group stage in the last 4 years that in the previous 10 when its been all the same. And its a good thing.

How are champion teams from lower level leagues ever supposed to enter CL group stage otherwise if they are exluded from the "elite-only" CL ranking? Or maybe its locked for certain group of teams from privileged leagues? Uefa says: treat EL seriously, give your best in that competition, your league will go up in the ranking and as a result champion team from your country will skip some qualification stages in CL and thus will have greater chance of entering CL group stage.

Lower level league teams need work hard in EL to get their pay off in CL in the future, and thats good, treating CL and EL as a whole is right, its not about 2-3 top teams from each country against each other, it's the entire leagues competing. German teams worked hard in EL and they got their payoff, one more team in CL.

The rules are fair and nobody's complaining but Italy, Italian teams dont give a shit about EL and it's their problem. Trust me everyone happy with these rules but ever-complaining Italians.

Okay I see your point about lower level leagues trying to work their way up and thats a very very good point, but the problem I feel is EL

If UEFA want teams to take EL seriously they better increase the profit off of it. Cuz right now its pathetic, its better to shoot for a UCL spot the following year than waste your time trying to get through EL. The prize money isn't worth the risk of injuring your best players etc. If you really want to link EL then have the final four get a chance to play in UCL the next year automatically or through playoff stages, instead teams will still not give a shit and try to just focus on the league which gives them a real chance to get into UCL.

 

[Mad Biscione]

what four teams would you exclude from UCL then?, it needs to be gruadual process of teams progressing further in EL and slowly gaining in CL.

you're right when it comes to money, but hell other nations can get over it, german teams are richier than Italian, maybe even EL gains are nothing to them but they put league's good first, nation's good first. Italy every team is just looking at the tip of it's own nose, not giving a crap about anything else

 

[Pharaoh]

Well who said you exclude them from UCL? Why can't you expand UCL to have more spots?

You expand each group to 5 clubs

There are 8 groups so 4 get filled by the final 4 in EL and then you can just expand the qualifying round system. You only would have to add 2 matchdays to accompany the additions, I don't think that would be toooo much of a trouble.

 

[Mad Biscione]

Ok, that would happen in year 1 of your idea, what happens in year 2, another 4 teams enter UCL?, again who you decide to exclude, you just add 4 best teams from Europa Legue each year? Or it happens once, and you just say "Sorry, it was one time opportunity" to the next year's semifinalists?

Another thing, you promote teams not leagues, in your idea 4 clubs would have secure UCL group stage and their league position doesnt matter next year, cos they were EL simifinalists? Plus I'm sure what teams are waiting for is even more games, group stage expanded from 6 to 8.

The idea of one ranking is gradual, more balanced and promotes efforts of all clubs from the leagues, not just a few best teams which get some idividual gains, and league gets nothing. Teams play good, Uefa gives the league higher status and as a result they're getting closer to UCL.

 

[Pharaoh]

I'm just spitballing here to be honest lol I clearly haven't thought this out but my only beef is that EL makes sucha huge impact on the rest of the league but yet its not rewarding enough to those who are in it.

If they want people to stop QQing about they need to figure out a way to increase the incentive to try or care about EL

 

[Sassuolu]

i think it's fair considering that some countries have less CL teams therefore it would be harder for them to get up the rankings, it's a meritocracy, Italy other than the two Champions league wins by Milan and Inter and a semi final by Fiorentina in the UEFA Cup has not done much in Europe.